Navigating & Managing OVERWHELM ft. Susan Niebergall | Dieting from the Inside Out Ep.239
In today's episode, we have an amazing guest for you—Susan Niebergall.
I'm sure most of you follow her—and if you don’t—you should. Susan and I always have great conversations when we get together and we cover a lot in this episode. We talk about Susan's journey in jiu-jitsu, Susan getting out of her comfort zone, and the parallels jiu-jitsu has drawn for her—in coaching, fat loss, and life. We also talked about some of the myths surrounding weight loss and getting stronger, for everyone, but with a focus on women—especially as they're aging. Susan is in her 60's and is in the best shape of her life. We also went into being successful in weight loss transformation—it was an amazing episode.
There is so much you can take away from this episode with everything Susan and I got into, which is exactly what Dieting from the Inside Out is all about. We don't just look at the outer work, we need to look inward. As James Allen famously wrote, "You cannot travel within and stand still without." I know you'll enjoy and get a lot out of today's episode.
(00:00) – Introduction
(01:11) – Our sponsors
(04:42) – About today's episode
(06:53) – Catching up with Susan and jiu-jitsu
(16:32) – Jiu-jitsu seminars and parallels to weight loss
(28:18) – Parallels between jiu-jitsu and coaching
(39:56) – Prominent struggles in fitness and with goals
(56:47) – Where to find Susan
(57:53) – Closing thoughts and how to sign up for coaching
Transcription (click to open)
EP#239: Navigating & Managing
Overwhelm ft. Susan Niebergall
0:00:12.0 Jared Hamilton: And we are back with a brand new episode of Dieting from the Inside-Out. If you are new here, if you're new to the show, welcome to the show. My name is Jared Hamilton, and I'm so excited to come at you with another episode today, and to be honest whether you're a long time listener, and you've been here for all 200 and, I think, what? 38 episodes, I could be wrong, but 230-something episodes. I appreciate you or if this is your very first one, I appreciate you just as much. Thank you so much for being here. Now, today is a really cool episode because I'm interviewing one of my favorite people, but also one of your favorite people, so when it comes to the guests to the show, one of the absolute fan-favorites is Susan Niebergall. She's a good friend of mine. I joke, and say she's like my virtual mom. She's literally one of my favorite people on the planet. And if you follow me on social, more than likely you follow her, and if you're not, you should, but any time Susan and I get together in general, like great conversation happens and a lot of value comes of it, especially if a camera is involved or like we're doing content. So it's a cool episode. We got into a lot in today's talk.
0:01:11.7 Jared Hamilton: Now, before we get into all the goods, I do wanna give a big thank you to the sponsors of the show. Sponsor number one is FlexPro Meals. You guys know that when it comes to my meals in the FlexPro conversation, they're a staple in my life. I can't speak for everyone, but I know for me, my life is predicated on convenience, and I'm just not a walking, talking meal prepping machine and I don't wanna eat that food anyway, just... I get tired of chicken rice and broccoli. So for me, FlexPro is been super helpful because not only is it made by a chef and taste absolutely amazing, I still don't understand how they make it taste how they do for how low calories and how dialed in and healthy the food is and things like that, but it's all dialed in from the number's perspective, whether you're just tracking calories, calories and protein or the full-blown macro split.
0:01:56.2 Jared Hamilton: It's all that data is right there for you, and it's gonna save you more money than a drive-through. 'Cause what do we do whenever we don't have time to eat? We go make our best choice at a drive-through, but you're still gonna spend $15 a meal and it's still gonna be McDonald's or Wendy's or whatever the case is. Not that that's bad, but if you find yourself in drive-throughs a lot or you're finding yourself like running to grocery stores, trying to get just enough food for one meal, it's just all over the place and your wasting time, you're wasting money, and it's not that fulfilling or satisfying anyway. But FlexPro checks all of those boxes that way to no-brainer for all of this.
0:02:30.4 Jared Hamilton: So it's why I love them so much. But if you use my code, it can save you even more money. So if you use my code HamiltonTrained to check out, it's gonna save you 20%, which is pretty dope. That way you can eat the foods that you love and live off convenience still where you don't have to have everything perfectly aligned to make progress, but then it actually moves you forward with your goals. Okay, it's absolutely amazing. Check them out in the link in the description. I'm sorry, I'm a little bit getting a little bit tongue tie today. This is the fifth time I've tried to do this intro 'cause I keep messing something up, but we're gonna roll with it.
0:03:00.3 Jared Hamilton: And then sponsor number two is 1st Phorm. It's actually one of the first times I don't have one of their shirts on in a while in the podcast, but anyway, actually, I have their stickers on my water bottle right now, but sponsor number two is 1st Phorm. You guys know when it comes to the supplements conversation, my view of supplements is very different. I think supplements absolutely have their time and their place, but they are not like everything, but a lot of people are like "Well then Jered why do you have them as a sponsor of the show?" Is because I take supplements and they absolutely have their time and their place, when with anything else it has to be within context, you know what I mean?
0:03:31.7 Jared Hamilton: So you shouldn't be jumping on the fat burner train or doing... I'm gonna get a glucose disposal agent, like that kind of stuff, the vast majority of people should steer away from, but with things like the fundamentals like a multi-vitamin, like fish oil, like protein powder for getting your numbers up, that kind of stuff. Those things are really, really important. And if you're curious, if you're like, I have nowhere to start with supplements, I actually have a YouTube video in the description of this. It's my supplement talk that way it gives you an idea of what I take, why I take it, what most people should take, what most people should avoid, that kind of thing. I have that YouTube video below.
0:04:04.8 Jared Hamilton: But my thing is with 1st Phorm is you can't get better in my opinion. Everything from the quality of the products to how their culture is, to the mission of them, everything from the founder all the way down through every employee, I just... You can't beat it, and I love that I can send all of my clients and all of... Everyone I talk to who have these supplements questions to 1st Phorm, and I know they're gonna get taken care of. So it's one of those things. Definitely check them out, and if you want to save money on shipping because Amazon has us all spoiled and we all get pissy when we have to pay for shipping, I do have a free shipping link below, just click on it, it'll auto-populate inside your cart, and it'll save you money on shipping, but otherwise, let's get into today's episode with Susan.
0:04:44.5 Jared Hamilton: Now, because Susan and I kinda went all over the place, 'cause we were just kind of riffing in our conversation, and I kinda had an idea of what we wanted to talk about, but we talked about a lot. We talked about Susan's journey in Jujitsu, 'cause that's what's awesome. Susan's in her 60s, in the best shape of her life, and talking about... We blew through some of the myths and the misconceptions around weight loss and getting stronger and feeling better for everyone, but especially women as their aging.
0:05:08.2 Jared Hamilton: Great conversation. We're talking about how to be successful with just weight loss in this game of transformation in general. And then we also talked a lot about her journey in Jujitsu with starting Jujitsu, getting really uncomfortable, stepping way outside of her comfort zone, and then all the parallels Jujitsu has drawn for her with her inside coaching and in life and in clients and fat loss and all of that stuff. It was an amazing episode, and you're gonna have to try to not get something out of it. Like that's how value-packed this episode is, with everything Susan got into that she gives so much value, you're gonna have to try to ignore half the shit in there to not get some golden nuggets to take and apply to your life. Because at the end of the day, that's what dieting from the inside is... Dieting from the Inside Out is about. Sorry guys, my mouth and my brain are not cooperating today.
0:05:53.9 Jared Hamilton: But that's what Dieting from the Inside is about. Is us maybe taking a little bit of a break or not focusing as much on the outer work where we need to take a look inside. There's a quote by James Allen in his book, "As a Man Thinketh" it's one of my favorite books ever, and I suggest everyone to read it, is, "You cannot go within and then live without." If you really want to be able to have things like confidence, mass levels of happiness, be able to look amazing and feel amazing, you have to go do the inner work, you have to go inside, get uncomfortable and do what the name of the podcast is.
0:06:25.0 Jared Hamilton: You have to diet from the inside out. It's why the podcast is called that. It's why my coaching programs very first stage is called dieting from the inside out. It's because you can't do the outer work, fitness, nutrition without inner work and expect it to work. That just doesn't work like that. So I know you're gonna get a lot on this episode. Be sure and stick around for the whole thing, and then otherwise I can't wait to hear what you have to say. Be sure and subscribe and leave a review of the podcast. That always helps. Otherwise, I'll get Susan on and I'll talk to you in just a second.
0:06:53.4 Jared Hamilton: So what have you been up to? How's everything in the day, in the life of Susan? Like, what's going on?
0:06:58.4 Susan Niebergall: You know, it's been an interesting go of it of late. Not great, if I'm being perfectly honest. I have been... I've got the nagging hip thing which has been rearing its really ugly head of late, like I'm in pain everyday. Everyday. It's now a matter of the level, right? It's either some days, it just sucks, and then other days I feel it. It's pain... I don't even wanna use the word pain, 'cause my tolerance for pain is a little bit high anyway, which is another disaster, right? Because really, if your tolerance for pain is high, you tend to do things that maybe you might not wanna do, 'cause it really doesn't hurt. It just you feel it. But what I've been discovering between that, and I tweaked both shoulders in Jujitsu recently.
0:07:49.8 Jared Hamilton: No! No! [laughter]
0:07:51.1 Susan Niebergall: Well, it wasn't... It's not bad. So here's what happened, here's what happened. You will appreciate this. So I'm a beginner, I'm months into this, right? And I go to Dallas and I go to Jordan's Jujitsu all the time with him. Got to know everybody there and they're like, "Yeah, bring your belt, I've got a gi for you next time" and whatever. We'll participate, so perfect, I love that. So I did and I'm watching him work with Jordan. And then he brings me on, and he has another coach working with Jordan on some stuff while he's working with me, and he dives right in. Like I'm having to hold on for dear life. I'm holding on to his sleeves... Was it his sleeves or his... I don't know. I'm holding onto something. And we are just doing scoot, scoot, scoot, scoot, scoot, scoot, scoot, and I'm holding on for dear life, he's showing me no mercy whatsoever. And so I'm like, mm-hmm, holding on for dear life out of the gate. And then we went through the rest of the thing; it was a great session. And the next day, I'm like, "Okay."
0:08:54.7 Jared Hamilton: That's a lot.
0:08:56.2 Susan Niebergall: That was a week ago.
0:08:57.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:08:58.5 Susan Niebergall: And it still, it still hurts. Like they're better. But I just tried to... I went outside and just tried to do a chin-up, and I was like, "No, not gonna happen, not right now."
0:09:08.7 Jared Hamilton: That sounds like... So what you just described sounds like if I have a ton of Jujitsu, like when we have like... So our big professor doesn't train out of our school. He has to come visit us in the Jujitsu lineage and stuff. He... But he comes like three, four times a year. But when he comes, there's a ton of training. It's like, days in a row, multiple times a day. They recently had a summit where they brought in him, our professor, and then three... Like overall, three world-class competitors. And it was like, people flew in, it was this big deal. Well, I had like... I wanna say I had like 16 hours that week on the mats.
0:09:47.4 Susan Niebergall: Wow.
0:09:48.2 Jared Hamilton: And you're not just... These guys aren't just doing technique. It's like, even in a technique, you've got positional sparring, which is just rolling still. And then everyone wants to roll, then you're rolling with all these other people you don't normally roll with, and then you're rolling with the best in the world, and it's like... And whenever that happens or whenever I've competed, that thing you're describing, it's like I'll exhale and my joints will hurt. Like, it's... I'll describe it to non-Jujitsu people like imagine going on a roller coaster, not being strapped in, and they give you a towel to hang on to. Then you're just like... It's the worst.
0:10:22.9 Susan Niebergall: That's perfect. That's exactly what it is.
0:10:25.2 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:10:25.9 Susan Niebergall: And what I feel now is that this kind of thing takes way longer on me to go away, right? I'm gonna go see my movement doc at the first of next week just to go over something, 'cause he's into Jujitsu as well, so he can help me...
0:10:40.6 Jared Hamilton: That's awesome. That's so helpful. [laughter]
0:10:42.6 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, oh my god, it's so helpful, because I need to be more on top of it. But I will say this, the pace of that particular session was so fast, I liked it, it was drilling the same two things over and over and over and over and over again. But I paid a little bit of a price. It's been pretty uncomfortable. So between that and the hip... And actually, here's a weird thing too. Jujitsu, I go in... I went in yesterday, actually, and at the beginning, my hip was like, "Aah" And warm up a little bit, and we order the warm-ups a little bit different, so my hip can warm up first, and then we'll do the warm-ups, you know? 'Cause we would start with scoots or shrimps or something, and it's like, my hip's not gonna start with that. There's no way. I've gotta warm up my hip before I do that. [laughter] You know?
0:11:32.7 Susan Niebergall: And so, we reordered things. And as I go through a session, it's like, I don't even remember my hip anymore. It is not even a factor. So, jiu-jitsu is really... It really is, I don't wanna say helping, but man, it feels so much better when I'm done, and then I don't pay a price on it later. So, it's really bizarre. But the shoulder thing has been pissing me off, 'cause it's right here, both of them, right in these two...
0:11:57.5 Jared Hamilton: Oh, really? Jeez.
0:12:00.1 Susan Niebergall: Right here. Both! And I've really jacked them up pretty bad. [chuckle]
0:12:05.4 Jared Hamilton: That's so hard.
0:12:05.5 Susan Niebergall: It's better. I'm gonna go to the gym later and have upper body... I can do most everything, maybe not the way that I want to right now, but, it's part of the age, it's part of... And it sucks, you know? It just sucks. I'm gonna do a lot of... Actually, a lot of future content around this, 'cause this has been a significant struggle for me.
0:12:25.2 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:12:26.4 Susan Niebergall: Having to find being grateful, having to be able to look for the positive in things that I can do.
0:12:32.7 Jared Hamilton: It's hard.
0:12:33.4 Susan Niebergall: It's not easy.
0:12:35.1 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. So what's funny is my fix to that is whatever the thing is, I get it tattooed on me. [laughter] Like, I have like... My very first tattoo is... I wasn't very grateful. It's why I have a gratitude tattoo on my arm, so now I have to. This whole sleeve is a bunch of mental triggers. I have a new... I'm actually probably gonna get... I don't know where I'm gonna put it, but I have a new one that I wanna do, and I want to put another word. I can't decide if I'm gonna put it on my forearm or up in here, but the new one for me that I've been struggling with but also progressing through them, 'cause you know, it's like that thing, it's like your biggest struggle is also, at the same time, it's like the biggest thing you're progressing with. Mine is equanimity. That's my biggest one is basically releasing expectations, emotional neutrality, calm within the storm, a lot of that being totally equanimous. It's a good scrabble word.
0:13:31.1 Susan Niebergall: That would do well for you in jujitsu too, by the way.
0:13:33.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, 'cause if you are... You don't have equanimity in jujitsu, you tap really quickly. [chuckle]
0:13:36.3 Susan Niebergall: Exactly, exactly.
0:13:40.2 Jared Hamilton: The way my... One of my coaches puts it, and this coach of mine, he has every ailment you could imagine. Long story short, back in the day, he did the most obscene amount of big boy drugs, so his heart's not very good. His health isn't very... All that shit is in the trash. He prides his jujitsu game on not sweating or using effort, 'cause he's like, "Oh, I can get really... I can... If I'm really good at technique, I don't have to sweat or use fitness. Dope." But his big thing is, this is fine. That's his... We have a guy that just joined who's almost a little over 400 pounds and...
0:14:18.8 Susan Niebergall: Oh, wow.
0:14:20.9 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. Being underneath side control on that boy is an animal.
0:14:22.9 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. Is a different experience.
0:14:24.0 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. And I have catched myself saying, this is fine. In spite of all that, this is fine.
0:14:30.3 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. It's good.
0:14:31.9 Jared Hamilton: It's so hard 'cause you wanna panic, right?
0:14:34.8 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. Oh, yeah. And I've... My coach is starting to spar with me. We do it like five, six minutes every session at the end. And of course, he's directing the whole thing to set me up to learn how to, okay, I'm in this situation. What can I do? What are my options with the repertoire that I have? Which has been great, 'cause honestly, that's what I'm learning the most, is how to apply. I'm learning all these separate little movements, but now I'm learning how to connect 'em or trying to use 'em. But yeah, if someone's laying on your chest or something, and this happened in Dallas with Alex. Alex was laying on my chest. I'm like, "Holy shit." [chuckle] Wow.
0:15:13.6 Jared Hamilton: So it's funny 'cause for those that don't know, with jujitsu, pressure isn't just pressure. It's not just like this 100 or 200-pound blanket laying on you. If someone knows what they're doing, you get in jujitsu for six months and you already know how to play the pressure game a little bit, let alone a black belt or something. Now that 200 pounds is on a ball point pen.
0:15:33.5 Susan Niebergall: Yes. Yeah.
0:15:33.7 Jared Hamilton: So there's a guy at our academy, no one can replicate his pressure. So I usually don't panic anymore. You know how at first you panic city. I'm pretty good with not panicking anymore. I've been training for three, four years now. And I don't really panic anymore. That's just like... It's kinda numb to it. But then I roll with this gentleman named Josh. Josh is a brown belt. And Josh... So in jujitsu world, he's been doing this for a really long time, that's a big deal. Guys will own academies at brown belt and not even be black belt yet. And I swear to God, he weighed 250, on my collar bone. Dude weighs like 185. And I'm like... And I don't panic. And all of a sudden, I started panic breathing.
0:16:22.8 Jared Hamilton: And then, of course, he was like, "Oh, I love it when they panic breathe." And I'm like, "Fuck you, man." [chuckle]
0:16:27.7 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, really.
0:16:28.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, it's bad, but...
0:16:32.8 Susan Niebergall: It's so interesting because I went to a... Our academy had a women's only kinda two-day... Two-and-a-half day event last month. And I just... I was so young... Well, I'm still young into the game, but then, very... Even more so than now. And, yeah, everyone saying, "Yeah, go, go, go, whatever." Well, I think I was one of two white belts there. Everyone else was purple and up, pretty... And blues, I should say. I mean, it was a lot of black belts there.
0:17:00.8 Jared Hamilton: Still, mostly purples is scary.
0:17:02.6 Susan Niebergall: A lot of purple... A lot black belts were there. And it was done by three women black belts, of course. And so I was so intimidated, I didn't even know what they were talking, I didn't even know their language. They're showing... They each got to show their favorite pass or their favorite whatever, and...
0:17:17.2 Jared Hamilton: Oh, and of course it's something stupid and complex and...
0:17:18.7 Susan Niebergall: And it's something so far over a beginner's head. So the first day I almost... I went home, I was in tears, I'm like, I'm not going to go back. And then I'm like, "No, Susan. No, no, no, no. Go back. Let's bring down the expectation here. You are a beginner."
0:17:36.3 Jared Hamilton: Equanimity. [chuckle]
0:17:37.9 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, yeah, right? I had to... I have a little come to Jesus meeting with myself.
0:17:42.5 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. I love that.
0:17:44.0 Susan Niebergall: They asked for feedback on this, and I gave 'em a lot of feedback from a teacher perspective, like there's a lot of things that they could do to be more aware of who their audience is when people sign up. So okay, guys, we've got three white belts in here. Someone needs to kinda hang with the white belts...
0:18:02.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. Absolutely.
0:18:03.6 Susan Niebergall: And make sure they can get out of this something that they can take away and not feel like they...
0:18:06.7 Jared Hamilton: Not wanna quit. Yeah. 100%.
0:18:08.9 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. Because they talk about wanting to retain women in this sport. And I'm like, then you got to meet us and understand that this is intimidating, and you just get what you can. Well, I don't know what to get. What should... I don't know what I don't know. And so all of that, if they had somebody that would have kept an eye on me and the other person maybe or whatever and just helped us, give us suggestions, "Why don't we cut it down to this for you? Let's try getting... "
0:18:40.0 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:18:41.3 Susan Niebergall: Whatever. Then I'm like, "Man, I can do this. I can do this." I think things like that will make the sport way more welcoming for anybody.
0:18:49.2 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. No, without a doubt. Even look... I agree with that 100%. Even when I go to seminars or whatever, I get this... This is the thing, it is I feel like that into my bones, 'cause even right now, I'm a... I have two stripes on a blue belt, and I love the sport. I love training. It's not where it's like that stage where it's like, I don't know if I'm gonna make it. I love it so much. And I will go to seminars, and I'm just like, "Why am I fucking here?" You'll get these... They're bad-asses, but it's like, "Wait a second. They're showing some 37-step sequence to something I would never do."
0:19:29.4 Susan Niebergall: I'm like, "Could you go back to number one? What was the first step?"
0:19:33.2 Jared Hamilton: Right. I can't tell you how many times they've even had a guest instructor, I've gone to a seminar and they're showing this five different 30-step sequence things, and I'll look at my partner, I'm like, "I'm still doing the first one all day. I'm not even touching that other bullshit." And then there are a lot of times that the professor will come around, make his rounds and he'll be like, "How are you doing?" I'm like, "I'm stuck on the first one still", and he goes, "Good, keep doing it." And he walks away and I'm like, "Okay."
0:19:56.8 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, yeah.
0:19:57.1 Jared Hamilton: Right.
0:20:00.2 Susan Niebergall: Okay. I think the hardest part of that weekend was, they would show something and they say, "Okay, go find a partner and let's drill this." And I'm like, "Nobody wants to partner with me," because I'm the new kid. And when we had to introduce ourselves, I said, "Look, I'm literally brand new," and I don't blame them. I don't take it personally, but it makes you feel like shit.
0:20:21.2 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:20:22.3 Susan Niebergall: It's like your childhood worst nightmare. No one wants to work with you. And so a lot of times I did... Somebody would come over at some point. There were two or three people that really reached out and one was a purple belt and one was a blue belt, and they were super kind to me and they were teaching me essentially. And I know that helps them too, when they teach somebody, it's really helpful, but I'm sure that's not what they wanted to do every single time we were drilling. I understand. They come to this thing to learn and to spur, to drill with people at their level. I get it. So it's just a lot of maybe more awareness as to who is going to be in your audience and maybe plan accordingly for that. I think that little thing can make something like that so much more valuable.
0:21:08.7 Jared Hamilton: Without a doubt. Even at my academy, I'll find myself with some of the newer guys 'cause I was there. I know first... It's one of the reasons you and I have such an easy time coaching people is 'cause we know what the other side is like. We know what...
0:21:24.0 Susan Niebergall: Yeah.
0:21:24.1 Jared Hamilton: 'Cause what you're describing, I've met a lot of people who are like, I feel like that in weight loss, I feel like that going to the gym, I feel like that with whatever, but even as where I'm at, sometimes I feel like I'm the biggest impostor trying to teach other people at the academy. I don't like to lead class or anything, but I know what a scared shitless white-belt looks like. I know what a white-belt that's about to quit looks like. And so a lot of times I'll pull them over to the side or I'll go out of my way and be like, "Hey... Whatever. Let's you and I work." Or I can tell they're like... 'Cause at our school, they'll do instruction throughout the class, and then afterwards everyone rolls. And they just have that new kid in class vibe. And I'll go, "Hey, do you wanna roll?" And they're like, "Oh, sure." But then instead of me just fucking destroying them, I'll ask them, "Okay. Hey, what do you wanna work on? Do you have questions?"
0:22:11.6 Susan Niebergall: Yes. That's the teacher. That's the teacher.
0:22:14.8 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, 'cause I don't wanna... I just know what it's like, and I'll ask. I'll just go, "Hey, do you wanna work on anything? Or do you have questions?" And sometimes they're like, "I just want you to try to kill me." I go, "Bet. Let's roll." [laughter]
0:22:27.2 Susan Niebergall: Okay. Yeah. Let's go, let's go.
0:22:28.5 Jared Hamilton: But nine times out of ten they're like, "Hey, we were doing this back thing and I just... Was my hands this way, or were my hands this way?" But I think there's so many... With all of that... Even with this game of weight loss and improving yourself, I think there are so many parallels. You had the easiest chance in the world to quit and you did it. You have all these things like the hip pain, the shoulder pain, but you're finding ways to work around it and still doing things in your control. This is hard as fuck. Jiu-Jitsu is hard but jumping into things that are hard and then it gets harder is just a lot. So do you find... 'Cause there are so many parallels to weight loss. [laughter] It's everything.
0:23:06.9 Susan Niebergall: Oh my God, there are so many parallels and the overwhelm I think is it too.
0:23:13.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:23:13.3 Susan Niebergall: 'Cause you know how overwhelming Jiu-Jitsu can be with all the terms and...
0:23:16.2 Jared Hamilton: Oh my gosh.
0:23:16.8 Susan Niebergall: Like learning a language. And so there's that component.
0:23:19.3 Jared Hamilton: It straight up is Omoplata.
0:23:20.3 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. Right?
0:23:21.7 Jared Hamilton: It's not English.
0:23:25.9 Susan Niebergall: So there's that component. I just remember feeling so overwhelmed to learn... How am I gonna learn all this shit? It's hard for me to remember anything anymore it seems like. And now I have to remember, okay, on this move, if I do da, da, da, da. We learned another thing.
0:23:41.9 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. And on top of it, Japanese and Portugese. [laughter]
0:23:44.9 Susan Niebergall: Oh my God. And it... [chuckle] We were learning gosh called The Gift Wrap. Is that something... Is it?
0:23:53.2 Jared Hamilton: I love the gift-wrap.
0:23:54.4 Susan Niebergall: So I do too now, but he was describing it, I'm going, "What the hell did you just say?" [laughter] It was just like... And he goes, "Trust me, it's not as complicated as what it just sounded." And so literally, we go through it step by step by step, now do this, now grab that, da, da, da, da, da, roll da, da, da, all these things, and then we start putting the sequences together. And then I left there thinking, "Okay, cool." And I literally write everything down.
0:24:21.0 Jared Hamilton: I'mma gift-wrap the fuck out outta somebody. [laughter]
0:24:22.7 Susan Niebergall: I write everything down. So now I have this notebook that I practice rewriting everything so I remember. It's like I'm studying again. And I actually love this, I love the cognitive challenge, and I love... The physical challenge is crazy, 'cause I know where my... I see where... I'm starting to see where my strengths are going to be in this sport because of my fitness level. Jordan was helping me and he was saying, "Holy shit, your frames are so... Your frames are so strong."
0:24:54.0 Jared Hamilton: I bet.
0:24:54.1 Susan Niebergall: And I'm like, "That makes perfect sense to me."
0:24:56.5 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:24:56.5 Susan Niebergall: That's kind of what I do. And what was interesting about being at that women's thing is we're all dressed in our Gis and nobody knows who the hell I am. I just say I'm an online fitness coach, whatever, I'm 62, blah, blah, blah, until people started finding me on Instagram. And all this...
0:25:09.4 Jared Hamilton: They're like, "Holy shit."
0:25:11.2 Susan Niebergall: Well, it's so funny because they were talking about how one of the black belts 'cause she and I work out at the same gym actually.
0:25:18.1 Jared Hamilton: Okay.
0:25:18.3 Susan Niebergall: And so we see each other. She goes, "Yeah, did you see? She deadlifted 250." I'm like, "I deadlifted 250," and they're looking at me like, "What?" Because they thought I was this 62-year-old lady.
0:25:29.6 Jared Hamilton: That's hilarious.
0:25:30.4 Susan Niebergall: This old lady woman coming in here, and then... So now they all follow me.
0:25:32.7 Jared Hamilton: And you can't tell... And with the Gis you can't tell muscle tissue, you can't see definition.
0:25:36.7 Susan Niebergall: You can't see anything.
0:25:37.8 Jared Hamilton: Anything.
0:25:38.2 Susan Niebergall: And then they see my Instagram and literally, one of them reached out to me today and just said, "Hey, I just wanted to say hi, and I wanted to ask, how's your Jiu-Jitsu been going? Tell me what's going on. And I just wanna say I love your Instagram. You're so inspiring to me." And I'm like, "Wow." It's so funny...
0:25:56.0 Jared Hamilton: That's awesome.
0:25:57.0 Susan Niebergall: How they look at me one way, at this poor old woman... [laughter]
0:26:01.8 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:26:02.4 Susan Niebergall: And now it's something else, but... So I've helped a couple of them, so it's kind of...
0:26:06.2 Jared Hamilton: And I love that.
0:26:06.5 Susan Niebergall: It's coming full circle and...
0:26:07.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:26:08.3 Susan Niebergall: But the big... I guess the take home for me for that thing was, I am so glad I stuck through that. It was the hardest thing I've ever done mentally, and it was hard physically obviously.
0:26:19.1 Jared Hamilton: Absolutely.
0:26:20.1 Susan Niebergall: Oh my God, I was dead by the end of that.
0:26:23.0 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:26:24.1 Susan Niebergall: Dead.
0:26:25.0 Jared Hamilton: A couple of week recovery, you're like...
0:26:26.8 Susan Niebergall: Yeah.
0:26:27.1 Jared Hamilton: It still hurts to brush your teeth. [laughter]
0:26:29.9 Susan Niebergall: Yeah.
0:26:30.3 Jared Hamilton: I love that. That's so good, man. I'm telling you.
0:26:32.6 Susan Niebergall: But you were talking about parallels. How many people do we see? We see people all the time that are so overwhelmed with all the things they wanna change at one time. And it's like going to that seminar and trying to put together this fancy-schmancy sequence of things and trying to do it all at once. You focus on the one part, I focus on one part. That's what we like to have them do, is focus on one thing that you feel like you can grasp and drill it over and over and over and over.
0:27:01.2 Jared Hamilton: Absolutely. I just actually, a few weeks ago, wrote an email, it's on my email list. It's like my top five life principles I've learned from Jiu-Jitsu, or something like that. There's so many just like that. You have the complex thing in front of you, in your case, it's, all right, what's the one thing I can do? How can I make this in the simplest form that I'm actually gonna execute on? One of my favorite take-homes that helps me a lot from Jiu-Jitsu, from a application like weight loss or life is just take inventory of what's in your control and what's not, and then keeping a level of emotional neutrality.
0:27:35.7 Jared Hamilton: I'm telling you, when a 400 pound boy is on top of you, and you cannot breathe, he doesn't know how to use his pressure yet either. That's the scary part. And he weighs 400 pounds, and he's on top of you, it's like you want to panic, and it's like, well, this arm is not in commission, and that's buried under here. But what is in my control, I can get on my side. Okay, I can breathe a little bit better now. Well, my left leg is trapped, but my right leg isn't. Oh, I can start to hook, I can start to frame. But under duress, under overwhelm, under panic, under someone trying to choke you, you're like... You have to go back and think logically what's in my control and what's not, and then act. There's so many different things. So for you, is there any other major parallels that have helped you a lot or that you see can draw this line? Or for you, what would be the biggest one?
0:28:29.4 Susan Niebergall: I'm fighting... I'm trying right now with the whole injury thing and just kind of being in pain every day to some degree, it is mentally exhausting. And when there's a time where I don't feel my shoulders or I don't feel my hip anymore, I'm like, "Wait a minute, this is what it's like."
0:28:48.8 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:28:50.3 Susan Niebergall: And to be honest, I haven't felt that way in, I don't know, how long, it's always nagging. And I've tried... I'm trying to practice what I preach. I need to focus on things within my control, things that are gonna make me feel better. So the same thing we tell people, if you're injured or whatever, focus on what you can control, focus on what will make you feel better, help things that you can do to feel healthier. Because once you start feeling better, other things start coming. Maybe even motivation kicks in a little bit, you start feeling better, then you're more apt to do things. So I think there's a lot of that that I'm going through right now, like living the dream. [laughter] I'm doing...
0:29:36.8 Jared Hamilton: I'm curious if this happened for you at all. I remember when I started Jiu-Jitsu, it was a big shift. In your and my day today, we are the experts, people are coming to us, we're the ones with all the answers, we're the ones that can talk high level complexity and have all this experience, and we're the ones trying to teach it down here. But when I put on that white belt, I'm just like, I'm a nobody.
0:29:56.8 Susan Niebergall: That's right. Yeah.
0:29:57.6 Jared Hamilton: It was a totally different switcheroo. And it was hard.
0:30:01.6 Susan Niebergall: It's so hard. And that's why when I came home the first night, I was in tears and my husband was like, you are used to knowing what to do. You are used to helping others know what to do and all that, because you don't like being in this position. I said, and all true, all true. But I took it to... It's a different thing with Jiu-Jitsu, I think, because to me, it was like taking somebody who wants to learn to play flute, and you put them in some phonic band. A band that's been together for however long, and they're reading grade five, grade six music, and this little person doesn't even know how to put the instrument together, and that person is sitting in the band. What am I... That's how I felt, so it kind of magnified it to that for me. And I understand that for people losing weight or even newer to strength training, whatever, that's how they're gonna feel too, I think.
0:30:56.0 Jared Hamilton: We can kinda tell.
0:30:58.1 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. And so the teacher part of me kicks in, and I do a lot of what you were saying earlier. You're the person who will see it in their eyes that they are totally overwhelmed. If you were in that seminar, you would have come over to me. I am certain of that.
0:31:12.9 Jared Hamilton: I absolutely would have come over to you. [laughter]
0:31:15.0 Susan Niebergall: And if I saw... If I was a more experienced person and I saw someone feeling like that, I guarantee you I would have done the same thing. I'm uber-aware of that kind of overwhelm with people because I've been there, and I get it, and I recently got to experience it again. It's uncomfortable, it can paralyze you, it can paralyze you from doing anything.
0:31:40.4 Jared Hamilton: I think Jiu-Jitsu also makes it even... And weight loss as well. I think the parallel is crazy because not only... Like you said, there's the mental and emotional overwhelm. Those two are debilitating, but then you have physical. Then you're under someone, you have to now perform these weird movements that feel awkward, now your hip hurts, or now this is happening. So you've got the triad, you have the mental overwhelm, the emotional overwhelm, and now the physical overwhelm, because we know our physical influences our mental, and then back and forth, our mental, physical. It's crazy, but in weight loss it's the same thing. People will follow 18 different pages of everyone from you and me to diet culture, and it's like, I'm mentally overwhelmed, but I'm emotionally overwhelmed because I wanna do this, and I can't, and it's frustrating, but then they look like shit, they feel like shit, they go to the gym, and they just hurt, and it's not working, and they get the triad as well. So I just think Jiu-Jitsu fixes everything. [laughter]
0:32:42.1 Susan Niebergall: It certainly can, and to anybody out there who's never done it, man, give it a try. And here's the thing, and I'll be honest about this. I'm doing privates, I'm doing one-on-one. And because when I did my first one-on-one, the teacher, he was actually teaching his noon class, and so he got them started and then would come over to the side and work with me on some basic stuff. So I got the advantage of seeing a class while getting one-on-one attention, and for me, one-on-one attention was... This is how I knew I was probably going to succeed, at least, at the beginning. Is just having somebody focus on me and getting me comfortable with this and all that kind of stuff, and I'm so glad I've been doing this. I'm gonna dip into a class here and there.
0:33:29.2 Jared Hamilton: Hey.
0:33:29.3 Susan Niebergall: I think 'cause I really want to try other... Be around other people and learn that, and I'll probably do my instructor's class since he knows me.
0:33:37.7 Jared Hamilton: Sure. [chuckle]
0:33:38.1 Susan Niebergall: And knows what I can do, so I will feel more comfortable there, but for me, starting with one-on-ones just got me past that first bit of overwhelm. I think it's super helpful. It's been worth every penny. And I still wanna continue with those for a bit and kinda see what happens. But...
0:33:58.5 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:34:00.4 Susan Niebergall: That's how I've done it anyway.
0:34:00.5 Jared Hamilton: Well, it sounds like another great parallel. So let me ask you this, if you did not do one-on-ones and you just jumped straight into the shark tank, do you think you would have made it? Or if you would have made it, it would have been astronomically harder?
0:34:13.9 Susan Niebergall: Astronomically harder for me. And I...
0:34:15.4 Jared Hamilton: See, this is what... Go ahead, I'm sorry.
0:34:16.8 Susan Niebergall: And I think that's me. And I think that's a little bit of just how I am and seeing how classes are.
0:34:23.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:34:23.4 Susan Niebergall: And I know... It's like CrossFit, it depends on what box you go to, some of them are great, some of them suck, and I would assume Academies are very similar.
0:34:32.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, yeah.
0:34:33.4 Susan Niebergall: Some of them will just throw people and say, "Okay, start to... " whatever. So there's a lot of it depends on how things go. I think there really is. But I think for this kind of sport, it can be intimidating anyway. You're up against somebody, you're on somebody, there's a lot of stuff that's very out of the box and unusual, so that's the whole thing right out of the gate. And then you add into a class, everyone that looks like they know what they're doing. And then you're like, "What the fuck is that? I don't even know what you're doing."
0:35:08.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:35:08.3 Susan Niebergall: And so it's hard to have a class. I guess where I was going with it was I feel like having that one-on-one attention to build some confidence in me has helped significantly.
0:35:23.2 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:35:23.2 Susan Niebergall: 'Cause I'm a different person with this now than I was two, three months ago. And I'm not so sure...
0:35:26.8 Jared Hamilton: And you're gonna learn more, like faster. So much faster.
0:35:32.2 Susan Niebergall: Yes. You're gonna learn more, you're gonna learn faster. I have more opportunities. Literally, I bring a notebook and I take sloppy notes.
0:35:36.9 Jared Hamilton: I love that.
0:35:37.1 Susan Niebergall: And then I come home and rewrite them just so I have it in my brain, 'cause it's constant repetition, it's constantly looking at these, visualizing, "Okay, I'm doing this, I'm hooking, I'm doing da da da da, I'm doing all of this," stuff has helped me so much, and I think I have more of an opportunity for that. Like yesterday, my coach was saying, "Okay, now let's go write this down," and so we go to my notebook and he...
0:35:58.2 Jared Hamilton: Oh, there we go.
0:36:00.4 Susan Niebergall: He helps me word it.
0:36:01.3 Jared Hamilton: That's awesome.
0:36:01.8 Susan Niebergall: So I can visualize it more. But...
0:36:03.6 Jared Hamilton: That's great. That's... You talk about parallel to weight loss.
0:36:07.0 Susan Niebergall: Yes.
0:36:07.0 Jared Hamilton: How many people stay overwhelmed because they're jumping into the shark tank. They're, I've gotta figure it out on my own, I've gotta go all in versus like... Or you could just work with a really good coach. You know what I mean?
0:36:18.8 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. Yeah.
0:36:20.2 Jared Hamilton: I've always said coaching is, it's why you and I are both coaches, is the ultimate life hack for whatever it is. I tell people, you can either save time or money, but you can't save both. You can either spend a little bit amount of money and let yourself suffer for the next decade. Not to try to extrapolate something that it's not, but the unfortunate fact in the world of transformation, that's how it is for most people. The amount of people I talk to who have been what I call part of the dieting for decades club. Whereas if you knew what you knew, and if someone's listening to this and they're like, I've been doing this for five, 10, 15 years of struggle, it's like, if you knew what you know now, back in year one, would you have spent a little bit of money, work with a bad ass coach to get you off the ground and in a good spot with lots of momentum and get your confidence and get your foundation built? Now that at what, six months. It's crazy what six to 12 months of really good coaching will do. It'll change your life. It's insane.
0:37:11.0 Susan Niebergall: Hundred percent. And we see so many people who might be brand new to strength training and who are trying to learn online. And let me tell you something, that's super hard to do. That's super hard to do. And as you get to be in my age bracket, that's really hard to do, unless you are a go-getter, you take initiative, you're gonna do your research, you're gonna film yourself, you're gonna study. Most people aren't gonna do that, right?
0:37:36.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:37:36.9 Susan Niebergall: I mean, most people aren't. That's why you hire a coach to help you with all of this stuff, whether it's in person, online, whatever. I always recommend people of my age bracket to start with somebody in person first, so you feel comfortable doing things safely and effectively. And then, you don't have to work with them forever, but work with them so you start feeling more comfortable.
0:37:55.9 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:37:56.0 Susan Niebergall: And then you can explore all kinds of options, you know?
0:37:58.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. And this way, you're not gonna just fuck yourself, you know? It's like, especially... In my realm, where I really love to lean into the deeper inner stuff, like the binge eating emotionally to sabotage that... The real gray area stuff. Half the time, especially with even that stuff, you're half the problem, where our... Psychology teaches us that our minds crave what's familiar. Well, if you have a decade of struggle, you're gonna unconsciously drift towards that way until you have someone saying, "You're fucking doing it. Stop it. We gotta to go over here now," you know?
0:38:30.5 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, yeah.
0:38:31.6 Jared Hamilton: Even getting back to the jiu-jitsu analogy, there was a technique I was struggling with; I was working with that savage fucking brown belt. And I was... Like, in jiu-jitsu, where you lack in technique, you make up for in effort, right? And I'm sucking, 'cause he's a killer. And I was making basic fundamental incorrect moves. My hips were up, I wasn't cutting my hip, and he goes, "Stop. Pause." What? "Look where your hips are," and I go, "Oh, shit, they're up." He goes, "Cut your fucking hip." And I go, "Oh," and there went his arm. And he's like, "Where's my hip check?" I'm like, "Oh shit." I put my hand to check his hip. And it's like these basic fundamental things, 'cause I'm so overwhelmed with the roadblock in front of me. I didn't realize my whole... Everything got sloppy. But how often do we see someone so frustrated, the scale isn't losing, isn't going down, so now they're starting over Monday, or they're so overwhelmed with binge eating that now they're like... They're not even tracking their calories anymore, where it's like, we have so many moving pieces, and it's so hard. And for most people to do this on their own... Not that they can't, but some people blatantly can't. But then other people, it will take them, quite literally, literal years longer trying to play this game on their own versus three, four, five, six months with the right person, and it's like, it's over.
0:39:44.9 Susan Niebergall: Hundred percent. There'll be so many starts and stops over. You know, start over, try it again, start over, and the frustration level will be outrageous.
0:39:53.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. No, I love that. I love it. Is there... I'm curious, is there anything else, like lately for you, that you've been like... That you've been seeing with people you're talking to and working with and conversations you're having? Has there been anything specific that's really been standing out amongst more prominent struggles people are having or bigger solutions or anything like that lately?
0:40:13.4 Susan Niebergall: I think the thing that comes to me is, everyone wants to build muscle, right?
0:40:17.9 Jared Hamilton: Mm-hmm.
0:40:18.6 Susan Niebergall: And I don't think people truly understand what kind of process that is. Like...
0:40:24.7 Jared Hamilton: That's such a good point.
0:40:24.8 Susan Niebergall: I'm gonna do a month or two to build muscle, I'm good. No, no, no, no. [laughter] No, you're not! Not yet!
0:40:30.6 Jared Hamilton: Yep.
0:40:31.1 Susan Niebergall: You know? I mean, people... And here's a question I get all the time. 'Cause I'll post random kinda transformation pictures up every now and again, and I don't have a lot of different photos of me back then, so it's always the same two or three, 'cause I really don't have any. But I always get the question of how many... How long between the one on the left and the one on the right, right? And by the way, just a point of contention on this, it's always left to right on these, you know? The earlier one needs to be on the left.
0:41:00.1 Jared Hamilton: Yes. I hate it when people have 'em backwards, and it's like...
0:41:01.1 Susan Niebergall: I can't... 'Cause I never... Yeah. Anyway, that's...
0:41:03.3 Jared Hamilton: We don't read a book right to left.
0:41:05.9 Susan Niebergall: A little sidebar there, okay?
0:41:08.8 Susan Niebergall: So people ask me how long in between, and I'm like, "I don't know. I don't keep track of that, because it's a long time." I mean, the answer is years. And if I sit down, okay, I was running that race, so that race was in this year, whatever, blah, blah, blah. This is the only way I figured it out, 'cause I didn't keep track at all. And people, when they hear years, some of them get discouraged, and I said, it's not a point of being discouraged. It's kind of a little bit of a reality check here, number one, and to show you that it is possible, but to also show you that you can have so much fun that you're not gonna give a shit how long this takes, you know?
0:41:48.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, I'm curious... I wanna interject really quickly, do you... Honest opinion, do you think because you didn't care, the duration, you didn't have a timeline, do you think that's half the reason in that state you were so successful? Like, do you think if you were doing what so many people do every day, they're like, "Why haven't I lost yet? Why haven't I lost yet? I should be further ahead"? Like, do you think if you were in that state of like, "I have to do this," you would've fallen off, or do you think...
0:42:11.5 Susan Niebergall: Hundred percent. Hundred percent, for me, yes. For me. I... And I get a little pushback from people sometimes saying, you know, "Well, I need some sort of like goals." Okay, I get that, I get that. But then people start saying, "Well, I wanna build this much muscle by this date," or "I wanna lose this much muscle by this date."
0:42:28.4 Jared Hamilton: No. [laughter]
0:42:29.2 Susan Niebergall: And we both know how bad that is.
0:42:31.8 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:42:32.8 Susan Niebergall: That is a hole you don't wanna go down, right? Because that's gonna be a hard one to crawl out of. There's gonna be all kinds of crazy shit that you're gonna do to try to meet that goal, this random date goal, you know? But I understand some kind of structure is good. And so, what I found that worked for me is giving myself goals that I... Things I wanted to accomplish, like "I wanna be able to get a chin-up." That was one of the first things I... That was my very first goal.
0:42:58.5 Jared Hamilton: Weighted chin-ups for reps.
0:43:00.4 Susan Niebergall: And yeah, and so weighted... Now it's weighted chin-ups for reps, right? As soon as these guys get better, I'm back on that again, you know? And here's a little tangent here too. Great example. I have a history of shoulder issues on and off for years, and of late, they've been really good until this came up. But I had tweaked it, I don't know, six months ago, something like that. And so, my goal of weighted chin... 45 pounds for reps have been... I have to take a break from it. And then I hit it back again. When my shoulders are ready, I just go back to it. It's not like it's over. "Oh, well." It's just, "Okay, I need to let these... Chin-ups is the one extras I can't do right now."
0:43:41.6 Jared Hamilton: Right.
0:43:41.8 Susan Niebergall: Can I overhead press? You got it. I can do... I can do lateral raises right now. I can do rear... I can do shoulders any which way. But I can't pull my body weight right now, because it pinches the shit out of these right now. So you're gonna have setbacks, you just keep going. But for me, it was giving myself these goals, like "I wanna get a chin-up." That was my first goal out of the gate when I started working with Jordan. And then it was like, "Okay, that 100 pound dumbbell over there looks kind of cute. I would love to be able to row that thing."
0:44:11.2 Jared Hamilton: Let's go.
0:44:11.8 Susan Niebergall: Okay, so that's... I'm knocking on that door right now. So there's things that I think help keep you moving that give you a tad more purpose with your training. How many times do people say, "I wanna lose weight and build muscle." Well, doesn't the world wanna do that?
0:44:27.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. [laughter]
0:44:28.6 Susan Niebergall: I mean, right?
0:44:29.5 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:44:30.3 Susan Niebergall: It's nice, but it's not specific enough for almost everyone.
0:44:34.0 Jared Hamilton: Sure.
0:44:34.8 Susan Niebergall: I think you need to narrow that down, so, okay, you can keep the weight loss one separate, but for your muscle building, what do you wanna do? You wanna deadlift your body weight? You wanna squat your body weight? You wanna get some chin-ups? You wanna get some push-ups? Start getting more specific with those performance-based things. That's what drives me, anyway.
0:44:54.7 Jared Hamilton: I think that's amazing. Well, and I think the balance, and I've recently heard this, ever since I've really been leaning into the equanimity conversation has been coming up a lot lately is it's like, well, there's such... The dichotomy of that, because what... And what... This is when I got a lot of clarity is... And this is what I try to teach clients too, is there is a... If we have a Venn diagram, the two circles with the middle intersecting. You have... Equanimity and ambition are on each separate circles. And the ambition of, "Oh, I want to get this... I want to squat my body weight," or "I wanna lose a 100 pounds," or "I wanna... " Whatever the thing is, the ambition is what we wanna have, and the outcomes that we wanna have is what gets us to actually act, right? It's what gets us to say, "Okay, I'm gonna get on a bet and go do that thing."
0:45:38.2 Jared Hamilton: But then, when we are in the trenches of doing it, we need to shut that switch off and turn on the equanimity switch, as in release of outcomes. It'll happen when it's timed to happen. It's... It'll... Where if you have one bubble over here is total nasty ambition: "I want this and this. These are my outcomes." And then the other side is total equanimity as in "I have no expectation." 'Cause if you have no expectation, you're solely that, you don't have goals. But there's the intersection, where it's like we have... Where they both live together. It's like the dichotomy of when I am setting these goals, here's what I want, but then when I'm in the trenches, I let go of all expectation. And that's actually what you did with your huge transformation. You go, "That's what I want, but then it'll happen when it's time. Here's what I want, and I'm gonna execute." But then when you're in the trenches, you're not, every other day, "Why haven't I lost weight yet? Why haven't I lost weight yet," you know?
0:46:30.7 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, that's exactly how it is, is... I didn't even own a scale for most of that time. [laughter]
0:46:36.7 Jared Hamilton: That's amazing.
0:46:38.1 Susan Niebergall: It's so funny, we were talking about this the other day, Jordan and I, about how I got a scale when he did his first cut that he posted on... Three years ago or something. Yeah, it's so funny, because I bought a scale for the first time 'cause he says, "Do it." 'Cause I didn't wanna lose weight, but I didn't own a scale. I honestly didn't know how much I weighed either, to be honest.
0:47:00.3 Susan Niebergall: So I got on the scale, and I found... I posted on Instagram every day, and this was more for me to get into weighing myself again and seeing and experiencing the fluctuations like we tell everyone about, right? So I found those photos of the stuff that I... Of my weigh-ins. And you know what's funny? I weigh one and half pounds more now, and that was three and half years ago.
0:47:23.5 Jared Hamilton: That's amazing.
0:47:24.4 Susan Niebergall: So this is... Yeah. It's kinda cool to see, 'cause I look very different. [laughter]
0:47:29.8 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:47:30.5 Susan Niebergall: I was... Then... I had lost a lot of weight at that point, but I was thin, and I was starting to put on muscle.
0:47:37.0 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, no muscle, no strength.
0:47:39.0 Susan Niebergall: And now, I'm bigger. I look bigger. Even from a muscular perspective, I carry more body fat now. This is totally how I wanna live, right? I've made this decision. And I can keep an eye on my weight and just kind of, "Yeah." If I wanna dial it in, okay, I'll just dial it in a little bit, you know? And whatever happens happens, but when people start giving themselves these, "Okay... " I just talked to a lady who wants to lose X number of pounds before this wedding in a month or whatever, and... "What should I do?" "Well, you should do what you should do whether you have this wedding or not," and, like, we went through the whole thing. Because the second you start putting that deadline on there, what happens if you start weighing yourself and you don't feel like you're on track...
0:48:25.1 Jared Hamilton: Panic.
0:48:25.7 Susan Niebergall: To meet this goal? Panic. Then we do crazy shit when we're panicked, right?
0:48:31.5 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:48:32.5 Susan Niebergall: I can imagine being panicked in jiu-jitsu and arms and legs just flying everywhere, you know?
0:48:36.9 Jared Hamilton: That's an easy way to get tapped.
0:48:38.5 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, right?
0:48:38.6 Jared Hamilton: Actually, to be honest... Like, the parallel there, I have a slower but very heavy jiu-jitsu game. I'm five feet, six inches, 225. I'm a thick boy. And I don't have these break... I have a buddy who breakdances on you, that's just his jiu-jitsu game. I would rather smother you and just hold really heavy. And you know what happens when people hold heavy? They go, "Oh my gosh, that's all I wanted. That's my arm now," and then I tap it. But because that's what happens, you panic, you make dumb decisions. It's the same thing.
0:49:06.9 Susan Niebergall: Yeah, yeah. And I think people make those kind of decisions when the scale's not moving the way they want it to or the way they think it should be, which is even worse, thinking it that way, right?
0:49:17.4 Jared Hamilton: I hate it when people shit on themselves.
0:49:19.1 Susan Niebergall: Oh my god, it's awful. And then they start doing crazy stuff just to make this goal, which made, really, not a whole lot of sense anyway. And you create weigh-in day, which is now... It's this big thing. And God knows, that was bad enough going to the doctor back in the day and having to do that shit. I mean... I dunno. I think not having those kind of deadlines was the one thing that changed my life the most. If I had to pinpoint one thing, it was getting... 'Cause it was a weight on my shoulders. It's a burden. It's a burden that you carry that makes you feel like you have to perform to a certain standard, right?
0:50:00.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. And it does... And it blatantly doesn't matter at all.
0:50:03.3 Susan Niebergall: Right. Yeah. And we do it to ourselves.
0:50:07.4 Jared Hamilton: You know what's interesting, another concept that I've been really leaning into lately, and I've been trying to teach clients this as well is, especially when we have crazy deadlines, once you get there, you're gonna wanna be somewhere else. Not that we shouldn't have goals, but what's funny... Susan, what's really funny is this concept first hit me, I heard it on a commercial. I was watching Hulu or something, some stupid show, and... Or no, it may have been a YouTube ad, but it was for a movie, but it was so profound. It was in an intergalactic setting. It was this robot bartender, and this guy was the only one in the bar. And the bartender... And the guy goes, "Alright, bartender, lay your bartender wisdom on me," and he's cleaning his glass, and he goes, "I bet there's somewhere else you would rather be than right here. But I bet if you were there, you would have somewhere else you would rather be." And he goes, "And I think our lives are just perpetual states of not wanting to be where we're at." And I'm like, "This fucking YouTube ad is hitting me in the feels, like real bad."
0:51:11.4 Jared Hamilton: But we see people get so obsessed with, "I've gotta lose the weight." But those same people also say, "I would do anything to be the fat version in high school." How many times do we hear someone say, "I wish I could be when I thought I was fat." And then they wanted to be something else, and then they're like, "I gotta lose weight as fast as possible." They get there, and they're like, "Well, now I wanna lose more. Well, I wanna get bigger. Now I wanna get stronger." It's like not that having these goals are bad, but knowing that when we're in that such a hurry, we're gonna get there and we wanna be somewhere else. I struggle with this myself with my bigger goals. It's like, even how many times you see someone in jiu-jitsu like, "I gotta get the blue belt." Then they don't even... They're not even excited they got the blue belt. Then they're like, "I gotta get my purple now," or "I gotta go do this tournament," or like...
0:51:47.1 Jared Hamilton: I struggle with this most in business. Like, when I set out to start a business, I'm like, "I gotta get my business off the ground as fast as possible," then I did. And it's like, "Well, now I gotta make what a nurse makes." Then I did. And I'm like, "Well, now I gotta make six figures. Now I gotta make... " And now it's like... Then one day, I looked up, and I'm like, "I've been literally nailing every goal for the past five years I've ever wanted to nail, and I never felt the actual gratitude or being present for nailing all those goals." And it's a dangerous cycle.
0:52:14.7 Susan Niebergall: It is, and that's so... Gosh, that's so important, not to be present while you're... And you're missing out on a lot of stuff because you're so focused on the next thing, you know? Yeah, I feel that. I feel that a lot, and it's... With just the recent injury struggles and not feeling great, all the feeling weak, feeling old and feeble is how I feel, and that's just not me. And I hate this feeling, but I don't wanna get so absorbed in that that I miss out on. Life's kinda short to do that. And the last thing you wanna do is get to 90 years old and regret. "Why? Why did I not let go of some of this?"
0:53:01.5 Jared Hamilton: What's funny is that's actually the... So on my big sleeve, the clock that's on my bicep right here, the reason that's there is this idea that... I don't know if maybe someone heard it or I heard it somewhere and I forgot who said it, but... I didn't think I'd heard anyone say it, but something that helped me a lot was this concept of the dichotomy of time is the concept of you have plenty, but you're running out. Because I struggle with being on one of those extremes. So just like this, where it's like, I'm running out of time, so I can get ambitious as fuck, and I can nail goals, but I'm not present at all. Because I'm running out of time, I don't have time to enjoy it. But then on the other side, it's like I'm present as fuck, because I have plenty of time. I'm running out, but now I have plenty of time. So I'm being present, I'm enjoying what's in front of me. But then it's like, life is short, though, you're running out. So it's that venn diagram, like the dichotomy of time, you have plenty, but you're running out and it's both. And I think the best things in life have a dichotomy. To give ourselves some grace, I think the most important things in life have a dichotomy. The dichotomy of ambition and equanimity, the dichotomy of time, you have plenty, but you're running out. It's all fucking crazy. Life is so weird. [laughter]
0:54:09.0 Susan Niebergall: It is. It messes with your head too, doesn't it?
0:54:11.3 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:54:11.7 Susan Niebergall: I mean... Gosh. To find some sort of balance with all of that, that's tough. We're all work in progress with that.
0:54:21.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah, without a doubt.
0:54:23.1 Susan Niebergall: I got a bracelet there a while... I've had it for a while and I totally forgot about it, and I'm starting to wear it more. It's just a simple thing... I don't have it on right now, simple thing... Circle that says warrior on it, and that's kind of my word, like if I were to get a word put on me, I would get that word, because that's what I want in here. I wanna be a warrior through all of this, because I feel like that strong mentality for me is really... Instead of the sitting back and "Woe is me and my hip's acting up again," blah, blah, blah... All that kinda stuff. Yeah, I'm trying to really be aware.
0:55:06.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. My... Like, it's not on a bracelet, I love that. I love that... See, you get a bracelet, I get a tattoo. [laughter]
0:55:12.0 Susan Niebergall: Well, it's funny, I was talking to Jordan about a tattoo.
0:55:15.4 Jared Hamilton: Yes!
0:55:16.3 Susan Niebergall: It may not ever be out of the question for me. That would be something totally crazy for me to do...
0:55:20.3 Jared Hamilton: I would love that.
0:55:20.8 Susan Niebergall: Out of my comfort zone. But yeah, you never know.
0:55:23.6 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. One that's been hitting me hard lately was... So I'll get them from... A song on Spotify will hit, and I'm like, "Oh, that's dope," because the cool thing with music is that when music moves somebody, like you get the tingles, you get whatever, but if it has a dope message, you can really implant some stuff deep. But the concept of rise up has really hit me hard lately.
0:55:45.2 Susan Niebergall: Yeah. I love that.
0:55:46.0 Jared Hamilton: Just like, regardless, rise up. At the end of the day, that's been one of my big ones lately, is just rise up. That's it, just... Cool, you got kicked in the fucking dick, just rise up. Whatever it is, so, yeah.
0:56:01.1 Susan Niebergall: I love that one. I love it.
0:56:02.5 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. So...
0:56:04.0 Susan Niebergall: Yeah.
0:56:04.8 Jared Hamilton: And I try to remember too, with stuff like this. The people we are most inspired by have that story of overcoming, that story of rising up, of being a warrior, of whatever. But when it's us, we're just like, "Oh, this sucks." It's like, "Well, we can be our own little story," and sometimes, it's hard to remember that.
0:56:24.3 Susan Niebergall: It is hard. It is hard to remember that, and that is something I am trying to be more aware of.
0:56:30.2 Jared Hamilton: Same.
0:56:31.8 Susan Niebergall: Just because I feel like everything is harder for me right now, and it could be easy to get sucked right down that rabbit hole, you know?
0:56:40.3 Jared Hamilton: So easy.
0:56:41.5 Susan Niebergall: And that's the last place I wanna be, so...
0:56:43.4 Jared Hamilton: Yeah.
0:56:44.6 Susan Niebergall: Definitely.
0:56:46.0 Jared Hamilton: Yeah. Fuck me. And this has been so good. I knew we would just get on here and start jamming on stuff.
0:56:51.0 Susan Niebergall: I know. We'd just start talking. [laughter]
0:56:51.7 Jared Hamilton: I love it so much. I love it. Well, where can people find you if they're like, "Fuck, this was good. I wanna learn to do that jiu-jitsu having, strong-ass, hip pain warrior style." Where can people find you?
0:57:06.3 Susan Niebergall: You can find me on Instagram, @susanniebergallfitness. I got a YouTube channel full of resources, especially for middle-aged women, Susan Niebergall Fitness there. Susan Niebergall Fitness everywhere, to be honest with you, and I have a book called "Fit at Any Age: It's Never Too Late" on Amazon.
0:57:21.7 Jared Hamilton: It's so good. It's behind me on my bookshelf. It is so good.
0:57:25.2 Susan Niebergall: Thank you.
0:57:26.2 Jared Hamilton: So good.
0:57:26.5 Susan Niebergall: God, it's a super easy read and just the story of all the screw-ups that I did, and anybody in my age bracket will relate to probably every single one of them, and then how to put the pieces of the puzzle together regardless of your age.
0:57:42.8 Jared Hamilton: I love that. It's so good. Thank you again for doing this, Susan. It was so good catching up, and I really appreciate you.
0:57:47.8 Susan Niebergall: It was great to catch up with you, my friend. Love you.
0:57:50.4 Jared Hamilton: Love you, talk soon. What an episode. I'm telling you guys, if you are not following Susan and reaching out to her and connecting with her, you absolutely need to. It's some of the best content you'll get online. She's one of the best humans you'll ever meet. And she's just a genuine person. You can't go wrong with that. Susan is one of the best... One of the best accounts you could have in your scrolling every day. Be sure, and if you got a lot out of today's episode, shoot her a message and say, "What's up?" and say, "Hey, I heard on Jared's podcast," and tell her what you got out of this episode. And if you got a lot out of this episode, my one ask is, I want you to at least share it with one person, whether that'd be sharing it on your Instagram story, the person that you thought of during this whole interview, I want you to send it to them and say, "Hey, I thought you'd get a lot out of this," because this stuff doesn't do any good if we keep it in our own heads. Part of this game is sharing it, and that's how we're gonna help more people, and you're gonna be part of that.
0:58:38.8 Jared Hamilton: Now, I don't wanna leave you hanging with just this episode, so I have a lot for you in the description and a lot of other things that are gonna help you a lot. Number one, if you're not following me on my other channels, you'll want to do that. If you're not following me on TikTok and Instagram and YouTube Shorts, that's where I'm putting a lot of my short, quick, rapid-fire content. If you like more content like this, like the longer stuff that's a little bit more in-depth, then you'll want to follow me on YouTube still; I upload all the actual interviews, long-form, to the YouTube channel, so youtube.com/JaredHamilton or the links down below. But if you like to watch your episodes of... Like if you wanted... If you were listening to this and you wanna actually see Susan and I go back to back with this, we have the episode fully uploaded there right now on YouTube as well as a bunch of other long-form content. If you like this long-form stuff and you are not part of my Fat Loss Simplified Community, I do trainings with myself and my staff in there all the time, multiple times a week, it's totally free.
0:59:31.6 Jared Hamilton: Here's the other thing with my community. You need a... You need a home base. One of the pillars of being massively successful at this game is you need to have a support system. Now, the best support system in the world is like a coaching dynamic, where there's expectations, there's accountability, the whole nine yards, but if you don't have that, you need a community of people who are surrounding you that are willing to help and love on you, and that you can go to to get fed, metaphorically speaking, because if you don't have a home base... Most people don't. This is why I created Fat Loss Simplified, my free community, it's on Facebook. Either the links down below or just search Fat Loss Simplified into Facebook Groups, and you'll find it. Add yourself, and I'll make sure you get accepted. But you need a home base. You need somewhere where... Through the trials, the tribulations, the bullshit of diet culture in life, you need a place where you can go to get grounded, to get loved on, to get seen and heard, and to get help, 'cause you can't expect to have all these things in life and you having all these outputs without some good mental inputs. So things like the podcast, so be sure you subscribe. Things like the Facebook Group and the trainings and the community in there. That's what changes you at a deep, deep level. That makes this way easier to keep going, so you need a home base, and if you don't have one, you'll definitely wanna go check that out.
1:00:43.3 Jared Hamilton: If you're newer and have no idea where to get started with this weight loss game, I have my... What I call the Fat Loss Checklist. It is my five-day email course. It's 100% free. It's down in the description as well. But it's basically over the course of five days. I'm gonna take you through the A to Z's of weight loss and how to lose weight, not struggle, and make it super, super sustainable and simple. Sorry if you can hear my dog wallowing on the ground right now, he decided to do that. But anyway, definitely check that out. I think you'll get a lot of value on it. And then lastly, because you're coming from the podcast, I do have a special opportunity with coaching. I've been saying that lately, 'cause my biggest focus right now is the podcast. And I have a special place in my heart for people who are willing to listen to me talking to a mic for 45 minutes, so I wanna reward that, and it shows me you're here trying to get help, like one of my favorite analogies kinda with people wanting to get help, is in Search and Rescue, like you have a search and rescue helicopter, and the helicopter can only hold 10 people, but there's 20 people in the water. The question is who they help. It's the people who swim towards them, that are saying, "I'm trying to get help." And I view you here on the podcast as people who are swimming towards the helicopter. You're trying to get help; otherwise, you wouldn't be here listening to me talk.
1:01:55.0 Jared Hamilton: So, with that being said, I do want to meet you halfway, basically, and when it comes to any kind of coaching inside the program, our 180 Impact Coaching, we make you have to apply, because at the end of the day, we only work with certain types of people. We don't work with people we don't think we can help, and we have a special culture inside the coaching program that I have to protect. So for you to get coaching from us and potentially see about the possibility of that, you do have to apply that way, we can make sure things are a good fit. But I already think, because you're coming from the podcast, you already are kinda favored with that. So there's a link below in the... There's a calendar link below where you can schedule your call, your application call with my team. That way, we can learn a little bit more about you and make sure things are a good fit, and then possibility talk... And then possibly talk about the potential of coaching with us.
1:02:42.6 Jared Hamilton: But if you get accepted, this is where the cool part comes in, because you're coming from the podcast. I'm basically giving away $4000 worth of goodies and extras and stuff that people pay money for for free because you're coming from the podcast, that you're a podcast listener. I'm giving you $4000 worth in extras just by joining the coaching program, assuming you get accepted. But the very first place that starts with is at the calendar link below to where you can apply and get on my team's calendar that way, we can make sure things are a good fit. Otherwise, I know that was a lot, I really appreciate you being here. If you haven't subscribed to the podcast or left a review, it would mean a ton to me. Otherwise, we will talk to you next time.
Susan has been in some pain lately due to a hip issue, she also tweaked both shoulders in jiu-jitsu. Susan is a beginner and has been doing jiu-jitsu for several months, and after a particularly intense session, she ended up with tweaked shoulders. Even after a week, she’s still feeling that session.
Susan has found that during her jiu-jitsu sessions, after getting her hip warmed up it becomes something that she doesn’t even notice, so in some ways, jiu-jitsu is really helping her hip. Since she is older, it takes her longer to recover, which is something she wants to create more content around in the future.
Jiu-jitsu has been an experience for both Jared and Susan that has taught them equanimity—that is to say mental calmness.
Jiu-jitsu Seminars and Parallels to Weight Loss:
Early in her Jiu-jitsu journey, Susan attended a women’s-only seminar, where she was one of two or three white belts, with most attendees being more experienced. It was a very intimidating experience and Susan had to persuade herself to go back after the first day.
It has been Jared’s experience as well—who has two stripes on a blue belt and has been in the sport for 3 or so years—that seminars tend to be overwhelming. They have great, experienced teachers, but oftentimes only show more complex sequences.
Susan and Jared both agree that more awareness about who is in the audience and having a plan around that would really improve the seminar experience for those who are younger in the sport.
Since Jared and Susan both have experience teaching others, identifying these gaps is very easy for them, as they have been on both sides in other areas of life—like weight loss.
Learning all the terms and the sequences in jiu-jitsu is very much like the weight loss journey, where you are learning new concepts, terms, and techniques.
Susan loves the learning aspect of jiu-jitsu, she writes everything down and enjoys both the physical and cognitive challenge, and she is learning where her strengths will be. Susan’s fitness level makes an impact on her jiu-jitsu performance.
Going back to the women’s seminar she attended, while it was one of the hardest things she’s done, it was ultimately something she is glad she did.
At the seminar, and while learning jiu-jitsu, Susan must take small bits and pieces at a time and build toward greater ability and knowledge—which is the same for those new to fitness and weight loss.
Jared just wrote about his top 5 life principles from jiu-jitsu, and this breaking down of an overwhelming, complex topic into, “what can I do and what can I control; here are logical steps,” is a concept that helps in many areas of life.
Parallels between Jiu-jitsu and Coaching:
For Susan, focusing on what is in her control is the biggest lesson that is applicable between life, weight loss, and jiu-jitsu.
Susan coaches her clients to focus on what they can do—and things like her shoulder soreness are causing her to really need to practice what she preaches. She and Jared both have the experience of being experts in one field and now being nearly lost entering a new sport and having to go through the learning, struggling, and growing that comes with that.
Jared and Susan are both hyper-aware of how uncomfortable and overwhelming being new to something like fitness can be. Both jiu-jitsu and weight loss can be mentally, emotionally, and physically overwhelming
A person who is new to strength training has a lot of information to learn, will have struggles with workouts, and while they can just jump in and try to learn on their own, working with a coach can help them focus and cut through the noise.
Susan has started jiu-jitsu with one-on-one training, which has helped her build confidence. She has space to take notes and can be comfortable learning. This is the reason why Jared and Susan are coaches. They are here to help guide people through the process of transformation through weight loss.
Susan sees many people who are new to strength training trying to learn everything online—which can be a struggle—and encourages people to find a coach who can help them get through the learning and stay on track.
When Jared was working with a brown belt in jiu-jitsu, he became so focused on the “roadblock” directly in front of him that he didn’t even realize he was making basic mistakes, which the brown belt then pointed out during their training.
Jared and Susan often see clients of theirs struggle similarly in weight loss. If the scale isn’t moving or they didn’t follow their diet to a T, they stop tracking and constantly find themselves restarting These types of issues can be overcome with the right guidance.
Prominent Struggles in Weight Loss and Goals:
Susan has noticed that everyone wants to build muscle, but most do not understand the process.
People often ask, when she posts a transformation picture, how many years it took between the before and after, which is not something she can answer exactly—because the answer is years.
Susan doesn’t want the fact that transforming your body can take years to be discouraging because, if you are enjoying the process, the time it takes doesn’t really matter.
For Susan, not focusing on progress every day—or having a hard date—was better than pushing herself toward a deadline. She understands that people need goals, but finds that setting a performance-based goal like “I want to do a chin-up,” is more effective for someone to be successful and able to enjoy the process of losing weight and getting in shape, whereas saying “I want to lose X amount in Y days,” can set a person up to do all kinds of crazy things to reach that goal.
For Susan, the real answer is to do the things you should be doing to take care of yourself and to let go of the need to accomplish your weight loss by a specific date.
Jared similarly has found that having a distant goal but being okay with letting go of that expectation when you are working toward it is a balance that ultimately leads to greater success.
Goals can be a great thing, but each time you accomplish a goal, you will naturally want to achieve something else.
Jared has experienced this in his business endeavors. While he was constantly reaching (and even exceeding) his goals, he was constantly setting new goals and never allowing himself to enjoy his accomplishments.
Susan, with her recent struggles in jiu-jitsu and injuries, has found herself feeling old and feeble. She has had to work hard to not get caught up in those feelings and find balance. Being more conscious and aware of her feelings and mentality.
Ultimately, she’s stepped out of her comfort zone, has learned new things, and is better because she’s pushed herself.
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